Posts by Doubting Bro

42

Avoid Testing God in Your Heart - transcript of talk from District Convention 2012

by wannabefree in

for those who don't care to listen to the talk but would like to know what was said ... here ya go .... .

avoid testing god in your heart.

imagine the ancient israelites as they were slaves in egypt, under an oppressive pharaoh.. god brought nine plagues on egypt and then announced a tenth; the firstborn would be struck down.. can you imagine the cry that went out in egypt when the firstborn died, including pharaoh's own son?.

Doubting Bro

Thanks for posting this. This must have been a manuscript talk because it sounds almost word for word from the one I heard. Horrible.

162

No more 3-day DCs starting in 2013?

by respectful_observer in

apologies if there is another recent thread on this, but i have heard from 4 different people in 3 different geographic areas (including someone who does advance work for the dcs), that beginning in 2013 the three day dc program will be replaced by a second two-day circuit assembly.

some people were passing the info along like a secret, others seemed to think that everyone already knew.. if everyone in j-dub land is already talking about this, how is it not all over this forum??.

anyway, can anyone confirm or deny?.

Doubting Bro

Sir82, I'm shocked they haven't done that yet. I guess they have in year's past done that phone connection for 1 or two talks but it would make sense to do it for a large part of the program if they wanted to.

As for the rumor, it's something many have been thinking about for awhile but I'll believe it when I see it. The only reason they would move it to 2 days is if they could make a bigger profit margin.

Attendance is usually lower on Friday so many JWs have already made this a 2 day deal.

I was more shocked at them downsizing the CBS than any of the other moves we've seen in the last 10 years. I guess I was so shocked at that one because there wasn't a real monetary need to do that. I think that move was due to the shortage of 1) conductors and 2) people willing to host the meeting. That one is real insight into the mindset of the modern day JW (at least in the developed world).

171

Watchtower's Billion Dollars of Property Cannot Be Sold until Outcome of Conti Appeal

by Dogpatch in

30 minutes ago i just got off the phone with some important players in this case, and some things were relayed to me concerning a lot of details of the outcome of the last two days of court.

i am passing this on.

cynthia hampton, one of the main players in the candace conti case (and a close friend of 28 years), just informed me of a further, far more powerful move by the state of california against the watch tower bible and tract society of new york, inc.. by order of the superior court of the state of california - county of alameda (see documents below), until the watch tower's appeal, which won't begin until august 13th and will take up to two years to settle due to due process of law, has forbidden the watch tower to sell any more of its $1 billion in assets in the borough of brooklyn until the appeals case is finished, to assure they won't shelter their monies in the light of this most huge and devastating sexual abuse scandal ever to hit the watch tower society, and perhaps any other single-victim lawsuit.

Doubting Bro

BOTR - Thanks for your insight. In your opinion, do you think the WTS needs to appeal this all the way to the SCOTUS if necessary? I can't see them giving up on this because if it ends up in a loss, the precedent will be set and their ability to defend other suits will be compromised, correct?

Does anyone know if they've posted their appeal bond yet?

57

Rick Fearons wife Inez passed away

by mouthy in

jw
friends

did anyone hear that rick fearons wife inez passed away???

?.

Doubting Bro

Rick, so sorry to hear of your loss. My condolensces go out to you during what must be a gut wretching time.

42

24 baptized at Tucson, AZ today - attendance 5,670

by Gayle in

jw
friends

a friend, non-jw, went to convention today.

she observed about 1/3 baptized were youth.. ***********************************************.

i read article:.

Doubting Bro

Just came back from one on the East Coast. Attendance numbers (roughly):

Friday - 5,200

Sat - 5,300

Sun - 6,111

37 baptized. If you use the Sat stats, then it's .69%. Using Sun, then it's .6%.

15

Interesting conversation re: sexual abuse issue

by Doubting Bro in

i may be outing myself so i'm changing some minor detail but i wanted to relate a recent conversation over the sexual abuse issue.

i was at a party, er, gathering this weekend and there were several folks that i haven't talked to in awhile there.

so, i sat down at a table with several other guys and the conversation went like this:.

Doubting Bro

That's really what I think as well. Seeing him again this weekend and will explore further.

15

Interesting conversation re: sexual abuse issue

by Doubting Bro in

i may be outing myself so i'm changing some minor detail but i wanted to relate a recent conversation over the sexual abuse issue.

i was at a party, er, gathering this weekend and there were several folks that i haven't talked to in awhile there.

so, i sat down at a table with several other guys and the conversation went like this:.

Doubting Bro

Kinda reads like a drama from the convention. A little too perfect for my radar for what its worth.

So you think I'm being set up? This person isn't in my KH, isn't an elder or servant, has no connections and the other guys sitting at the table were no threat either. This guy has young kids and is really worried.

15

Interesting conversation re: sexual abuse issue

by Doubting Bro in

i may be outing myself so i'm changing some minor detail but i wanted to relate a recent conversation over the sexual abuse issue.

i was at a party, er, gathering this weekend and there were several folks that i haven't talked to in awhile there.

so, i sat down at a table with several other guys and the conversation went like this:.

Doubting Bro

I agree but what can you do? I will say that many born-ins like myself tend to NOT trust anyone. I agree that the elders should be disclosing that information and think the WTS policy is horribly wrong and protects the perp rather than the victim. They should do something to make it a little safer. I agree they don't always report and the WTS is to blame.

Me, I can count on one hand the number of people that I trust with my kids. I worry about them at school, at the kids care center at my gym, anywhere that I can't see them. I treat the folks at the KH the same way as "wordly" folks. Especially guys, although I know women can attack kids as well.

You can say that schools, daycare centers etc run background checks and get rid of people that do attack kids but what if your kid is the first one attacked? what if the first kid doesn't tell anyone (common problem)?

Maybe I'm just paranoid but I think this is a much bigger problem than a fringe cult. Short of finding a genetic marker that shows people who are prone to this behavor and executing them, I'm not sure that we can eliminate the problem.

Bottom line, trust no one.

15

Interesting conversation re: sexual abuse issue

by Doubting Bro in

i may be outing myself so i'm changing some minor detail but i wanted to relate a recent conversation over the sexual abuse issue.

i was at a party, er, gathering this weekend and there were several folks that i haven't talked to in awhile there.

so, i sat down at a table with several other guys and the conversation went like this:.

Doubting Bro

No, sorry the pay phone (do they even exist anymore) is what the elders were instructed to use when fulfilling their mandatory reporting requirement in states where they are required to report. According to what I've been told (never dealt with it personally), that's the advice given by legal.

I would guess that the elders would likely call the WTS legal deparment from their house since that's when I would call the service desk during the time I was a secretary.

15

Interesting conversation re: sexual abuse issue

by Doubting Bro in

i may be outing myself so i'm changing some minor detail but i wanted to relate a recent conversation over the sexual abuse issue.

i was at a party, er, gathering this weekend and there were several folks that i haven't talked to in awhile there.

so, i sat down at a table with several other guys and the conversation went like this:.

Doubting Bro

I may be outing myself so I'm changing some minor detail but I wanted to relate a recent conversation over the sexual abuse issue. I was at a party, er, gathering this weekend and there were several folks that I haven't talked to in awhile there. So, I sat down at a table with several other guys and the conversation went like this:

Bro 1 - hey, DB, how long have you been an elder?

Me - I quit a few years ago, just decided that it wasn't something I wanted to do anymore.

Bro 1 - laughing, I hear you man. Fair enough, but there's something that's bothering me that I was hoping to get your input on.

Me - Sure, that's what friends do right? what's up?

Bro 1 - Do you remember XXX? He was DF'ed a few years ago. I was shocked and so I stopped by his job and chatted with him right after. He said that there were some things from his past that he had to take care of but it's over now. So, I said, ah, it must have been some sort of normal thing like maybe sex (he was single). But, then I found out that this dude is in a max security prision for molesting a young child.

Me - Really? Wow, I remember XXX as a kid but didn't know him as an adult. Wow, that's just crazy!

Bro 1 - Yeah, I even went on vacation with him. It's scary because I would have trusted him with my kids. While that really bothers me, I found out that the elders knew about this guy and didn't do anything. So I talked to YYYY (a local elder that we both know, he's about the same age as me) and he said that when someone confesses to child abuse, they don't tell the congregation. Is that your understanding?

Me - Yes, that's exactly how it works. I never dealt with this sort of thing but you're instructed to call the legal department and do what they say. We're in a reporting state, so you have to go to a pay phone and report the minimial info without giving you're name from what I understand from someone that had to do that.

Bro 1 - Do you think that's right? How do you NOT beat the crap out of the person?

Me - Oh, I think its really wrong and I agree with you. Hey, the 2 other guys in the room probably would say the guy slipped right? (laughing). I tell you what, I would rather be removed or even disfellowshipped before I would not warn parents about a molester.

Bro 1- Yeah, I think that's a normal response, especially for a dad. But, are you saying that the society tells elders to not warn people. That's crazy. I just don't want to believe YYYY when he says that's the case.

Me - It's 100% true. It's something I never agreed with. BTW - I run the megan's law registery every six months, you should too.

Bro 1 - I do, blah blah about someone that lives several doors down that he's actually threatened!

More exchanges but you get the drift. There were others sitting at the table that did not say a word. I didn't bring up the verdict because I thought that I may out myself a bit more with all these folks sitting there. But, Bro 1 clearly knew about it because when I mentioned Sandusky, he quickly went back to the JW that is in jail.

This guy has a few young kids, is a great guy and is really worried about his kids. I think that the combination of the verdict along with his actual knowledge of someone that he GREW UP WITH, is causing him to be really concerned.

I'm going to follow up with him later. But, I see a light bulb going off.

So while some people are defending the org, there are loyal JWs that this is really causing pause.